Ten Commandments

[UNODRAGONE]

Ever take a real good look at the ten commandments? My priest was speaking about it at church Sunday and I just noticed some things that didn't make too much sense to me and was wondering if anyone else felt the same. Also if you think a certain commandment is ridiculous ( no offense to religious people out there it's just a conversation I am not trying to debunk anything)list it and why

King James
Version
And God spake all these words, saying, I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
1.
Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
2.
Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
3.
Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
4.
Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
5.
Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.
6.
Thou shalt not kill.
7.
Thou shalt not commit adultery.
8.
Thou shalt not steal.
9.
Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.
10.
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour’s house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour’s.


First off number 2, I know people who have a fit when they see a picture of Jesus Christ on a cross or on the wall of someone's house claiming the second commandment says its wrong, from what I read, it says God or Lord not Jesus Christ. And if we want to take this quite literally, it says "Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth" doesn't that mean animals too since they are in the earth and water?
The 3rd commandment says don't take the lords name in vein, then what is so wrong with saying Jesus Christ?
The sixth commandment says thou shall not kill, but haven't there been many religious wars? What about policeman?
Number 7 I have never followed :) adultery is having sex with someone that you are not married to but hey I am not going to marry someone unless I am sure we are compatible in all ways!
And that whole thou shall not steal, wasn't there mention of stealing in the bible taking bread to feed his family or something like that?
Feel free to flame me if I mentioned something wrong, these are only my opinions

[Shield_Wulf]

Things have been mistranslated before, the 6th commandment was at first Thou shall not Murder.

[DarkHunter]

I've always kept number one, "Thou SHalt have no other gods before me." I've never had other gods before me.

[UNODRAGONE]

I've always kept number one, "Thou SHalt have no other gods before me." I've never had other gods before me.
crazy bastard :)

[MythMyrnaM]

10.
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour’s house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour’s.


that last part saddly made me giggle a little. what with it being this day and age and all.

[UNODRAGONE]

that last part saddly made me giggle a little. what with it being this day and age and all.
wow I didn't even catch that

[Canis Lupus]

Guy carrying the Commandments:
"I've just receives the fift- *CRASH* Err, TEN Commandments!"

[ShadesNightmare]

I think the whole point of the adultry one is that silly. Your not supposed to have sex with anyone but your wife. And if you follow the commandment that means neither before, dureing or after the marriage. Think about it. IF you do the dirty with someone your not married to, your doing someone's future wife. Which is wrong in the eyes of the LORD. according to the commandment. see?

[BCvonRayfus]

You know, I've never even tried reading the King James version of the Bible; I have a more understandable translation, so one might assume that I wouldn't understand those commandments very well the way they were written in the King James, but I understand it just fine. I've said a billion times that I'm a christian. About not taking the Lord's name in vain, that means, you're not supposed to use: God, Jehovah, Jesus Christ, etc. as a curse. It's just as bad to say Jesus Christ in a cursing sort of form, because Jesus is God as a man on Earth. The rest of the Commandments shouldn't be hard to understand.

[UNODRAGONE]

You know, I've never even tried reading the King James version of the Bible; I have a more understandable translation, so one might assume that I wouldn't understand those commandments very well the way they were written in the King James, but I understand it just fine. I've said a billion times that I'm a christian. About not taking the Lord's name in vain, that means, you're not supposed to use: God, Jehovah, Jesus Christ, etc. as a curse. It's just as bad to say Jesus Christ in a cursing sort of form, because Jesus is God as a man on Earth. The rest of the Commandments shouldn't be hard to understand.
If Jesus is God as a man on Earth, then what did God mean when he said you should not have any God but me?

[UNODRAGONE]

I think the whole point of the adultry one is that silly. Your not supposed to have sex with anyone but your wife. And if you follow the commandment that means neither before, dureing or after the marriage. Think about it. IF you do the dirty with someone your not married to, your doing someone's future wife. Which is wrong in the eyes of the LORD. according to the commandment. see?
I wonder if you marry that person though is that still considered adultry since that person is your future wife/husband?

[ShadesNightmare]

Then wait until your married. lol. Don't you just hate that logic.

[UNODRAGONE]

Then wait until your married. lol. Don't you just hate that logic.
with all my little mental midget heart lol

[BCvonRayfus]

God meant JUST THAT when he said not to have any other gods but him! As in, you're not supposed to worship (OR CREATE, because that's what most ancient civilizations did after God showed his presence, they made up their own that pretty much did nothing.) anything else as a god. That could mean like, actual physical IDOLS made of wood or stone which may or may not still be done today, AND worshipping every day things, as in, putting them first in every situation of your life like, money, PEOPLE, whatever. Jesus was God incarnate, not some other God. At the same time, Jesus was the son of God, because God created him, but gave him all of his power. Therefore, Jesus was God, not A god, THE God in the body of a man, but Jesus was God's son, because God made him, and watched over him from Heaven. Forgive me if my preachiness gets annoying, but it's the Religion section, talking about the Commandments. This is where I bust out. Anyway, about adultery, I don't know where the crap you got NOT GETTING MARRIED out of adultery, but it means, you're not supposed to have sex BEFORE marriage, OR have sex with SOMEBODY ELSE/ cheat on your wife or husband in any other way. And you know what, I'll throw this in, I'll get burned out of the country but I don't care, I say all that compatibility stuff is a load of nonsense, and an excuse to have sex more often. Maybe if nobody can give you that "wonderful feeling" during sex, it's because you've done it so much that you're used to the feeling and it BORES you!!! If you save sex for marriage, and for the person you really feel is the right person for you, compatibility shouldn't be a bloody problem! Besides, if you go off having sex with EVERYBODY just to figure out who you're "compatible" with, that's not finding a lover, that's finding somebody to have sex with just because they DO IT FOR YOU better than others! AND, unless you have a lot of nerve and care very little about your well being and that of the other person, I'd think that it's a little embarrassing to have sex with somebody and find that they don't get you a frakking orgasm very quick if at all, and then go have sex with somebody else and have the same thing happen! JUST SAVE IT!!!!

[Okami no hi]

Go BC.

[UNODRAGONE]

God meant JUST THAT when he said not to have any other gods but him! As in, you're not supposed to worship (OR CREATE, because that's what most ancient civilizations did after God showed his presence, they made up their own that pretty much did nothing.) anything else as a god. That could mean like, actual physical IDOLS made of wood or stone which may or may not still be done today, AND worshipping every day things, as in, putting them first in every situation of your life like, money, PEOPLE, whatever. Jesus was God incarnate, not some other God. At the same time, Jesus was the son of God, because God created him, but gave him all of his power. Therefore, Jesus was God, not A god, THE God in the body of a man, but Jesus was God's son, because God made him, and watched over him from Heaven. Forgive me if my preachiness gets annoying, but it's the Religion section, talking about the Commandments. This is where I bust out. Anyway, about adultery, I don't know where the crap you got NOT GETTING MARRIED out of adultery, but it means, you're not supposed to have sex BEFORE marriage, OR have sex with SOMEBODY ELSE/ cheat on your wife or husband in any other way. And you know what, I'll throw this in, I'll get burned out of the country but I don't care, I say all that compatibility stuff is a load of nonsense, and an excuse to have sex more often. Maybe if nobody can give you that "wonderful feeling" during sex, it's because you've done it so much that you're used to the feeling and it BORES you!!! If you save sex for marriage, and for the person you really feel is the right person for you, compatibility shouldn't be a bloody problem! Besides, if you go off having sex with EVERYBODY just to figure out who you're "compatible" with, that's not finding a lover, that's finding somebody to have sex with just because they DO IT FOR YOU better than others! AND, unless you have a lot of nerve and care very little about your well being and that of the other person, I'd think that it's a little embarrassing to have sex with somebody and find that they don't get you a frakking orgasm very quick if at all, and then go have sex with somebody else and have the same thing happen! JUST SAVE IT!!!!
compatibility is only one measure and please don't tell me there are not married people out there who are not satisfied with their partner and think about cheating. We are naturally sexual creatures that is as important as anything else in my opinion. AND I did not say go around and sleep with people to see who your compatible with, reread my post, I just know if I am going to spend the rest of my life with someone everything should fit, I am a sexually aggressive person, I don't have sex with people to see if they are compatible with me, I do it to fill a need, simple as that. I think it's worth it to wait but I don't think it's so horrendous if you don't.

[BCvonRayfus]

The post was directed at society, not one particular person. Forgive me if I offended anybody. I get very talkative sometimes when it comes to religious matters...

[J.L.R.]

compatibility is only one measure and please don't tell me there are not married people out there who are not satisfied with their partner and think about cheating. We are naturally sexual creatures that is as important as anything else in my opinion. AND I did not say go around and sleep with people to see who your compatible with, reread my post, I just know if I am going to spend the rest of my life with someone everything should fit, I am a sexually aggressive person, I don't have sex with people to see if they are compatible with me, I do it to fill a need, simple as that. I think it's worth it to wait but I don't think it's so horrendous if you don't.

STD man STD... :D

[Zequinox]

As for Commandment 2, creating a picture of anything religous is acceptable as long as you do not worship it or use it in a religious way. You are allowed to create it for visual purposes, but nothing else.

[Vagabond Flow]

Ever take a real good look at the ten commandments? My priest was speaking about it at church Sunday and I just noticed some things that didn't make too much sense to me and was wondering if anyone else felt the same.

Yeah, the whole God 'n' Moses show doesn't make much sense. It's not as if it actually happened or anything.

[Lilith]

I've always kept number one, "Thou SHalt have no other gods before me." I've never had other gods before me.

Right on.

[Canis Lupus]

Until one of those "gods" says right in my face that they exist, I won't believe in any of them. In other words: I'll never believe in any gods.

[UNODRAGONE]

STD man STD... :D
thats why I know the person before I'm with them :) Got to stay ahead of the game

[LV426]

They also make these things called condoms.

[UNODRAGONE]

They also make these things called condoms.

love those too :buttrock:

[GwynapNaud]

If you want a real head ache, look up the other two-hundred and some commandments. Like the one that says we can't eat weasels.

"Of the animals that move about on the ground, these are unclean for you: the weasel, the rat, any kind of great lizard" -Leviticus, 11:29

The entire book of Leviticus is pretty much all commandments, they are just never explicitly named as such, so they are usually ignored. If you want to puzzle over weird commandments, look there.

[LV426]

If you want a real head ache, look up the other two-hundred and some commandments. Like the one that says we can't eat weasels.

"Of the animals that move about on the ground, these are unclean for you: the weasel, the rat, any kind of great lizard" -Leviticus, 11:29

The entire book of Leviticus is pretty much all commandments, they are just never explicitly named as such, so they are usually ignored. If you want to puzzle over weird commandments, look there.

Unless it's a fish or a sea faring mammal then pretty much all animals move about on the ground. So does this mean we are all supposed to be vegetarians?

[GwynapNaud]

Depends on how you wish to interpret the dietic laws. It does say that all things that creep along the ground are abominations and unclean too eat, so in theory, yes, we should be vegetarians. On the other hand, it also lays out specific animals that are ok too eat, but it doesn't state if the one commandment supercedes the other, and if so, why have both listed? Furthermore, why go through the trouble of then listing specifically banned animals on top of it all, if they are all unclean in the first place?

Like I said, there are far more confusing commandments in the Bible beyond the ten most commonly given. There are even commandments about when you can and cannot look at a naked woman.

"Thou shalt not uncover the nakedness of a woman and her daughter, neither shalt thou take her son's daughter, or her daughter's daughter, to uncover her nakedness; for they are her near kinswomen: it is wickedness." -Leviticus, 18:17

"Also thou shalt not approach unto a woman to uncover her nakedness, as long as she is put apart for her uncleanness." -Leviticus, 18:19

The bible has a myriad of seemingly contradictory laws listed in it, and some that are just plain weird. Trying to puzzle them all it out is pretty much impossible, and relies heavily on personal interpretation.

[Goth Girl]

I think that one about creepething animals refers to things like lizards and snakes. Cows don't exactly creep on the ground. And isn't the one about nakedness mean that you are not to look upon a woman and undress her physically or even mentally unless with her consent?

[GwynapNaud]

"Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat." -Leviticus, 11:3

Thats why cows are safe to eat, they get a special exemption. As for things that creep, it also says that you can't eat birds that creep, and I've never heard of a creeping bird, so what exactly the Bible means when it uses the word creep, I'm not exactly sure. It sure likes the word though, it appears (or variants of it) 15 times in Leviticus chapter 11 alone.

As for the rules regarding women, the first is in regards to female relatives. Unfortunately, it never says whose relatives they are, so the commandment is a little vague. The second one forbids looking at a naked woman while she is "unclean". This refers to being in a state of sin, and several different infractions result in someone becoming unclean. Not all causes of being unclean are sins though, for instance a woman is considered unclean for a week after giving birth to a son.

It doesn't really give any consideration to the consent of the woman. Whether this is because consent didn't matter as much to the law in biblical times, or if it was because looking at them was a sin already so consent was irrelevant since they were already at fault is unclear.

[LV426]

Depends on how you wish to interpret the dietic laws.
Ah and there you hit the proverbial nail on the head. The Bible is not written law because it relies on interpretation in order to make it understood. Which depending on the individual reading the text the interpretation can be practically anything.

"Also thou shalt not approach unto a woman to uncover her nakedness, as long as she is put apart for her uncleanness." -Leviticus, 18:19

I believe the above refers to a woman who is having her period. At least that's how most religions interpret it. As far as I know it just means she needs to take a shower. This makes much more sense because most people would prefer to look at a clean naked person rather than a dirty ugly person. But then there are the Japanese that ruin that whole clean thing for everyone.

[sai-fujiwara]

I would think that it would refer to a woman in her menstral period also.

I know this may sound strange, but if you are a Christian, as opposed to being a Jew, you don't really look at the old testament. Most of what Jesus says in the New Testament (along with the deciples) just cancel out what is in Leviticus and such.

But if you are Jewish and your faith revolves around Judaism, then sure, go ahead and don't eat pig or rat.

On the other hand, perhaps before I start putting in my opinion, I should read all of the bible instead of just what they want us to think is in it.

[YoungFang]

Can god be omnipotent then if he backtracks on his own rules?

[J.L.R.]

Just a couple of things here. First off, there isn't much room for interpreting the Ten Commandments, IF you read the rest of Exodus and especially Leviticus, since they flesh out the basic laws as to what exactly they mean. Often when you have "interpretation" is that the reader has simply read what they want to read and ignore the rest. This is often seen with extremist occult like Christian groups, say the likes of those who protest funerals from Kansas, or Ku Klux Klan, or those Snake Wranglers also... albiet... from Kansas...

The fact of the matter most Jewish people, back then as they do now, didn't seem to have a problem understanding what exactly the Ten Commandments meant.

Secondly...

At the time of Christ there was a sect of Jews called the Pharisees, who kept the Ten Commandments to the most extreme since. They were so obsessed with the application of the law, they forgot the very purpose of the law. This is why of course, that you went from Ten general commandments to nearly 600, if I remember correctly.

Jesus Christ did not abolish the commandments. Jesus filfilled them. Jesus did not come to replace them, but to reveal their purpose, as is, to reveal sin...

[Rascaduanok]

For me, Jesus went to the heart of Judaism and brought out the very essence of what it had to say. The root cause of murder, for example, comes from anger and callous disregard of morality. A heating of the blood that blinds you to what you shouldn’t do. So he preached boundless generosity in order to prevent any such outcome, completely negating hostility with gestures of love.

Similarly, adultery stems from an initial lustful gaze leading to desire. For Jesus, every rule of the Torah (even seemingly petty or pedestrian rules) had a purpose and powerful inner spiritual significance. As far as I can tell with my years of studying Middle Eastern religions, he tried to bring this otherwise concealed spirituality to the fore. Moral action comes from inward motivation, and our inward motivation should consist of total self–surrender to God.

Interestingly (amusingly?) the Arabic language calls this act of complete subservience to God ‘islam’.

[J.L.R.]

For me, Jesus went to the heart of Judaism and brought out the very essence of what it had to say. The root cause of murder, for example, comes from anger and callous disregard of morality. A heating of the blood that blinds you to what you shouldn’t do. So he preached boundless generosity in order to prevent any such outcome, completely negating hostility with gestures of love.

Similarly, adultery stems from an initial lustful gaze leading to desire. For Jesus, every rule of the Torah (even seemingly petty or pedestrian rules) had a purpose and powerful inner spiritual significance. As far as I can tell with my years of studying Middle Eastern religions, he tried to bring this otherwise concealed spirituality to the fore. Moral action comes from inward motivation, and our inward motivation should consist of total self–surrender to God.

Interestingly (amusingly?) the Arabic language calls this act of complete subservience to God ‘islam’.

Bingo... :D

[Rascaduanok]

Bingo... :DAnd to add to that, since I missed it off my initial post, although rituals matter, they do NOT take precedence over the spirituality behind them. If you start getting hung up on rituals and forget whatever meaning lays at their heart, then you may as well forget it — you speak empty words only, and perform empty actions.

[Aeolus]

1.
Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
2.
Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
3.
Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
4.
Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
5.
Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.
6.
Thou shalt not kill.
7.
Thou shalt not commit adultery.
8.
Thou shalt not steal.
9.
Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.
10.


Yeah, look, kid. These are the basic ideas behind human morality summed up. Any philosopher can agree that killing, stealing, lying, and having rampant sex are not only immoral but dangerous behaviors.

The ten commandments are basic ethical concepts. There is not much to question. I really do feel you've been put up to this or you are trying to instigate something, but I'll try to keep my suspicions out of mind.

I also understand some people may disregard the first four, but I dont, and keeping them shows respect for others views, and I would really appreciate an atheist or agnostic strong enough to do that.

[DarkHunter]

Yeah, look, kid. These are the basic ideas behind human morality summed up. Any philosopher can agree that killing, stealing, lying, and having rampant sex are not only immoral but dangerous behaviors.

The ten commandments are basic ethical concepts. There is not much to question. I really do feel you've been put up to this or you are trying to instigate something, but I'll try to keep my suspicions out of mind.

I also understand some people may disregard the first four, but I dont, and keeping them shows respect for others views, and I would really appreciate an atheist or agnostic strong enough to do that.

Showing respect for another person's views is one thing. But that doesn't mean adherence.

Adultery can be classified as simply having sex before marriage. The Bible defines marriage as between a man and a woman, before God. So this is obviously quite outside of many people's beliefs. A) I don't believe in God so I'll always be an adulterer and B) Not everybody does the "man and woman thing."

There's nothing really wrong with sex. Yeah you can be smart about it and not bang every cheap whore that comes along (if only to stave off disease and unwanted pregnancy), but that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with the act. Leaving your door can prove dangerous after all.

"Honoring thy father and mother" is all well and good, but only if they deserve it. It is easy to create a kid. Its a whole nother ordeal raising that child responsibly and hence deserving "honor."

I cannot disagree with "thou shalt not murder" and "thou shalt not steal." Both are foolish and I tip my hat to whoever included those in as a commandment.

"Bearing false witness" (which I interpret to mean lying, correct me if I'm wrong), is circumstantial. Honesty is good, but its not allways the best policy as is popularly believed. If you can lie credibly, then it is particularly advantageous (consider that a mobster is going to shoot you for something you did; I would lie under that circumstance and get away).

The "danger" argued for some of these isn't really danger at all, simply immorality in the Abrahamic view.

[Aeolus]

[QUOTE]Showing respect for another person's views is one thing. But that doesn't mean adherence.

I'm not asking for adherence. I'm asking that atheists and aganostics would speak of God with respect rather than cursing his name, mocking him, etc.

Adultery can be classified as simply having sex before marriage. The Bible defines marriage as between a man and a woman, before God. So this is obviously quite outside of many people's beliefs. A) I don't believe in God so I'll always be an adulterer and B) Not everybody does the "man and woman thing."

To A, you should but it still doesn't obligate you to having sex before marriage, I haven't met an intelligant health official that doesn't suggest abstenance. To B, homosexuality is nothing but a farce of love and the result of sexual abuse/confusion. I do not support it and I dont care about 'many peoples' beliefs'.

The way you speak makes human relationships sound like a fad or a game, and I bet they are to you and a great deal of America, but a deeper love than sexual relations should underlie them. Sex appeal lasts a few years, true relationships are enjoyable and last much longer. There is so much more to marriage or love than just sex I really just dont have enough time to go into all of it.

There's nothing really wrong with sex. Yeah you can be smart about it and not bang every cheap whore that comes along (if only to stave off disease and unwanted pregnancy), but that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with the act. Leaving your door can prove dangerous after all.

Uh, yeah it does.

"Honoring thy father and mother" is all well and good, but only if they deserve it. It is easy to create a kid. Its a whole nother ordeal raising that child responsibly and hence deserving "honor."

You've never experienced pregnancy have you? It's not easy at all having children. Honoring them is an act of kindness and appreciation, it makes their lives easier and it may even keep YOU alive longer. There are also guidelines on how parents should raise kids in the Bible, mind you.



"Bearing false witness" (which I interpret to mean lying, correct me if I'm wrong), is circumstantial. Honesty is good, but its not allways the best policy as is popularly believed. If you can lie credibly, then it is particularly advantageous (consider that a mobster is going to shoot you for something you did; I would lie under that circumstance and get away).

The "danger" argued for some of these isn't really danger at all, simply immorality in the Abrahamic view.


Honesty helps other human beings know they can relay on what you are saying. You people condemn politicians for lying every day I boot up my computer and get onto these forums, why adopt it to your ethical policy?

[DarkHunter]

I agree that people ought to have enough respect for Christians as not to mock their god openly, but if their not around then it doesnt' matter.

Ahh you miss the point. Nothing neccessitates me to have sex before marriage. But the point is, Marriage is defined as union between a man and a woman, before the Abrahamic God. I don't believe in that being. A ceremony in his name would be pointless and I'll probably not have one when I choose to be married. So I'll never have the go ahead will I and I'll always be an adulterer.

I'm well aware of the complicated nature of Love and how it isn't about sex. I never suggested that a loving relationship was reliant on sex. I don't take these things as games. You show both a deliberate misunderstanding of what I'm saying and a generalization of who I am.

So tell me the dangers of safe sex between two unmarried people? With the use of contraceptives and protection to keep away the nasties, what is the big deal? Why don't you talk about the "dangers" of masturbation while you're at it.

Compare the acts of having a kid and raising a kid. The old joke, "You don't have a kid, the kid has you" rings true. Its easy to belt out a kid. Look at all the teen mothers. They do it with no problem. But where is their failing? In RAISING The child. Do you honestly think every parent deserves honor and respect? How about that mother who just hung herself and her four daughters in a closet? Should the eight month year old who survived "honor" her mother when she grows up? Should the baby be grateful to the mother for leaving her an orphan and murderering her sisters?

I'm not saying you should go around lying all day. I'm just saying, its not a big objective evil in every situation in life.

Philosophic and moral codes should be more widely applicable than the Ten Commandments.

[Aeolus]

QUOTE]I agree that people ought to have enough respect for Christians as not to mock their god openly, but if their not around then it doesnt' matter.

Ahh you miss the point. Nothing neccessitates me to have sex before marriage. But the point is, Marriage is defined as union between a man and a woman, before the Abrahamic God. I don't believe in that being. A ceremony in his name would be pointless and I'll probably not have one when I choose to be married. So I'll never have the go ahead will I and I'll always be an adulterer. [/QUOTE]

I see what you mean, but a marriage ceremony can still verify a wedding even if not performed in the name of God

I'm well aware of the complicated nature of Love and how it isn't about sex. I never suggested that a loving relationship was reliant on sex. I don't take these things as games. You show both a deliberate misunderstanding of what I'm saying and a generalization of who I am.

What are you condemning me for? I have no idea what you are talking about.

So tell me the dangers of safe sex between two unmarried people? With the use of contraceptives and protection to keep away the nasties, what is the big deal? Why don't you talk about the "dangers" of masturbation while you're at it.

There are all kinds of mental reactions to sex, it effects the mind strongly.

Compare the acts of having a kid and raising a kid. The old joke, "You don't have a kid, the kid has you" rings true. Its easy to belt out a kid. Look at all the teen mothers. They do it with no problem. But where is their failing? In RAISING The child.

Surveys and experts both say teen parents actually do a good job of raising healthy, law-abiding children.



Philosophic and moral codes should be more widely applicable than the Ten Commandments.

The Ten Commandments as well as other moral ideas (The Golden Rule, Turn the other cheek, sometimes even passive resistance appears in the Bible) in the bible have been adopted in one way or another by many areas of society.
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