Magic Is It Real? What do you think?

[Celtic Hill]

What is the difference between a wizard or a warlock???. Also any Magic users/believers please post your opinion on magic.

[---Arawn---]

What is the difference between a wizard or a warlock???. Also any Magic users/believers please post your opinion on magic.

I heard somewhere that a warlock is a wizard without the element of religion, someone who only makes spells to their own gain...

I did practice witchcraft when I was younger, but I stopped doing it... It's not that I don't believe anymore, but I really lost my interest on it... Now I only do meditation and prayers... It still work though :D

[MorganaFang]

What is the difference between a wizard or a warlock???. Also any Magic users/believers please post your opinion on magic.

Wizard, in most archetypes is a wise old man who happens to dabble in a little magic. Of course I'm being quite vague. But I'm too tired to go into Arthurian Legends, C.S. Lewis's and Tolkien's mythology on wizards.
Just keep a sharp mind that if anyone claims to be a wizard today, they are full of it and living a lie.

Warlocks, though made by popular media as the male version of a witch, it is not true. In fact in your previous thread, there was a discussion on them there.

[Goth Girl]

I've tried Blood Magick in the past, but all in all it was really dangerous. I have seen sertain things work when it comes to magick but for me it's all just too mutch of a risk. Also, how is it impossible for a wizard to exist now-a-days? If they're just wise old men that dabble in magick then I've met two.

[MorganaFang]

I've tried Blood Magick in the past, but all in all it was really dangerous. I have seen sertain things work when it comes to magick but for me it's all just too mutch of a risk. If you want to get into deeper stuff live summoning, blood magick, and stuff like that you should try to get ahold of William Wraithe. He was heavy into that type of stuff. If you want some beginer spells just ask me for a PM but I will not go into the dangerous stuff cuz I wouldn't want to be responsible for anyone getting hurt. Also, how is it impossible for a wizard to exist now-a-days? If they're just wise old men that dabble in magick then I've met two.

Yes let's encourage stupidity as much as possible and get young people involved with dangerous practices with older possible predators online.

Blood magic doesn't work, and is idiotic/dangerous. No more posts on it.

[Goth Girl]

Oops, I forgot to say idiotic. Thanks for reminding me. Seriously though, it is stupid. Take it from someone who's passed out from blood loss because of it. There, no more. PLEASE, DO NOT ATTEMT IT! Also please note that I no longer practice magick. Someone on another website thought I did but no, I haven't for awhile now.

[John 677808]

[QUOTE=MorganaFang;20 9992]Yes let's encourage stupidity as much as possible and get young people involved with dangerous practices with older possible predators online.

I am a predator. ;)

[MorganaFang]

I am a predator. ;)

Y'know I'd be careful joking about that because it could be grounds for banning you.

[DarkWolf]

Warlocks, though made by popular media as the male version of a witch, it is not true. In fact in your previous thread, there was a discussion on them there.

Actually it does mean male witch. Like I said:

Actually it was first used in Scotland to mean a male witch since 1568 and has been used to mean "in league with the devil" since 1300.

Yay for etymology!

:p

[John 677808]

Y'know I'd be careful joking about that because it could be grounds for banning you.

I was refering in a wolf predator like way.

[DarkHunter]

There aren't really many differences in terms. At base, they all seem to mean "magic user" though they are applied differently depending on a person's definition of magic.

Warlock is a valid title. Just because Wiccans and some Pagans reject it, doesn't mean it isn't.

[Dog of Heaven]

Magic does exsist, but not like the fairy Disney magic or the illusions magicians make. The magic that is real can be extreamly dangerous. Any contact with the "dead" or trying to get power from "spirits" is the magic that really exsists. These "spirits" are actually deamons trying to hurt mankind. Ouji Boards and Tarrot Cards are examples of dangerous magic. They may seem harmless, but if they are used to the full extent, it might be more than your life that will be threatened. (I just wanted to express my opinion, but a warlock is considered more powerful and evil than a wizard is. Besides that, there is no difference.)

[DarkHunter]

Magic does exsist, but not like the fairy Disney magic or the illusions magicians make. The magic that is real can be extreamly dangerous. Any contact with the "dead" or trying to get power from "spirits" is the magic that really exsists. These "spirits" are actually deamons trying to hurt mankind. Ouji Boards and Tarrot Cards are examples of dangerous magic. They may seem harmless, but if they are used to the full extent, it might be more than your life that will be threatened. (I just wanted to express my opinion, but a warlock is considered more powerful and evil than a wizard is. Besides that, there is no difference.)

A lot of pretty paranoia.

Magic is only dangerous to you if you are dangerous to you. Does that make sense? Magic doesn't come from "spirits" or "demons" but from yourself.

Quija boards and Tarot cards are only tools. Symbols. They are not dangerous themselves.

[MorganaFang]

Magic does exsist, but not like the fairy Disney magic or the illusions magicians make. The magic that is real can be extreamly dangerous. Any contact with the "dead" or trying to get power from "spirits" is the magic that really exsists. These "spirits" are actually deamons trying to hurt mankind. Ouji Boards and Tarrot Cards are examples of dangerous magic. They may seem harmless, but if they are used to the full extent, it might be more than your life that will be threatened. (I just wanted to express my opinion, but a warlock is considered more powerful and evil than a wizard is. Besides that, there is no difference.)

Complete and utter bull plop brought to you by the popular media that changed the idea of magic to suit entertainment (not really bad). Ouija boards and Voodoos are not at all what people think. If you'd actually studied magic further you'd actually see it's pretty existential. No one, on this board, or especially in their teens are capable of the "dark magic". Only being pretty dumb and melodramatic. I WAS one of those teens just for clarification.

[Celtic Hill]

ok, this is an interesting form (jk)... ok so... yes or no is magic real.... that is all i want

[MorganaFang]

ok, this is an interesting form (jk)... ok so... yes or no is magic real.... that is all i want

Uhhh people have said yes. But bare in mind it isn't in the sense of how a lot people talk about online or in the Llewellyn, RavenwolfSilverBoob' s or probably the majority of new age books most teenie bops read these days. Though I will say Llewellyn Books are definitely a lot better than most, I may have a bias because that Publishing company is practically in walking distance for me.

Darlin, that sig you have is lame, if you can't spell, you fix it. Don't bitch and whine.

[melodyhowler]

Magic is defined in your own terms. If you consider hypnosis to be a type of magic, okay. If you think it's a bunch of scientific bs, okay.

However, I WILL say that what you find in those 'new age' books is 90% bull. Astral projection, okay. Certain things, okay. OTHER certain things, new-age crap that's just a bunch of thrilling poetry and recipes for some really gross drinks.

No offense to any Wiccans or whatever out there; I say whatever floats your boat, but personally, I'm not about to recommend it to anyone.

[DarkHunter]

I can't resist.....

Magic-a change in accordance with one's will where under normally accepted methods wouldn't be possible.

Though in my opinion I think astral projection is just lucid dreaming.

[sabrina_lycaulf]

To me, magic lies everywhere, there's magic whenever someone believes in themselves, there's also magic in thoughts and no body knows for sure yet whether there isn't magic, so I still believe ;)

[Cristina]

Yes,magic is real...is very real,many people are studying white and black magic,but only 36% are made to discover the secrets she hides and practice her!

[Cristina]

oh yes,magic is very real...someone of here has sayd that the wizard's are very old and they dont EXIST!...they exist,i know many persons who are wizards...also my grandmother was and still is!
<y study black and white magic...some friends of mine too...> but here in this world nobody cares...:mad:
"Death is here
power of fears,
livingdeads cross the me...as well as u.
Lake of tears
blassing my skin.
killing the soul...and destroying the you.."
....and this things are not made to discuss in the public,if u whant to ask someone something like that or close of the subject,semnd a mesage...

[neverending_pain]

A wizard is more powerful than a warlock and more experienced

[ThrasherCub]

But bare in mind it isn't in the sense of how a lot people talk about online or in the Llewellyn, RavenwolfSilverBoob' s or probably the majority of new age books most teenie bops read these days.
A lot of wiccan magick doesn't work. Look at most things on wiccan magick, then involve pretty rhymes, lots of tools of specific colors, and if you're lucky, visualuization.

Absolutely none of that crap is magick. Magick is the actualization of one's Will, and when speaking about mystical magick (the stuff people tend to think about when you say "magick,") it's the actualization of one's Will via means other than those in the flat world.

Also, a note on blood magick; it does work if you know what you are doing. And if you're not part of the O.T.O. or the Golden Dawn, odds are that you don't have even the slightest clue what you are doing.

I shall spell it out for you.

What you are doing when you perform blood work is creating a bond between your vital energies and whatever it is that you are working with; let's say you're using blood on a talisman. You're charging your talisman with your blood; the following bad bad things can happen;


If you use a consecrated and/or powerful tool to do the cutting, you may well damage your astral vehicle and die a pitiful and inescapable death.
If the circle you have created is weak or incorectly made or maintained, your energies could leak out, which not only leaves the talisman undercharged at best, but may well attrack small vampiric entities.
If any other beings involved are less friendly than they appear, they may simply use the bond you created in order to sap you of energy.
If any other beings involved aren't the beings they appeared to be at all (very very common, actually!) you may well have bound yourself to something Qlipothic.
If there are any other beings in the ritual area due to poor or complete lack of banishings (also very very common), they may barge in and essentially steal the commection you were attempting to create.


So, yeah, don't do that.

Note: "flat" refers to non-magickal stuffs. There are lots of terms for this and, given the fact that I had taken a kind of Thelemic approach to this, I used the term most commonly used by the late great Ebony Anpu, founder of the Hawk and Jackal Cabal of the O.T.O.

36%
That is stupid. I am sorry, but there are no statistics on this subject.

As for the wizard/warlock thing, I've never heard a real magician talk about magicians like that. Ever.

[Rascaduanok]

I don’t believe in magic. Not in terms of it as wizards casting spells, at any rate. I believe in forces, actions, thoughts, etc. beyond our current scientific understanding. I believe that a wizard/witch who successfully casts a spell may indeed tap into or harness a power of some sort, but I submit that it has a rational explanation behind it. We may simply have not worked it out yet.

Look at ancient times compared to our modern ones: imagine a mediæval adventurer walking down one of our modern day corridors illuminated by electric lighting. Perhaps he draws his sword and stabs one of the lights. The light goes out and he receives a powerful electric shock. If he survives he may conclude that the builder of the corridor did indeed possess enormous magical powers, for he placed a light spell on a tube, and then armed it with a lightning spell!

Nothing magical about it, but I do consider ‘magic’ a convenient shorthand term for what I’ve described long ago in my opening paragraph.

[Goth Girl]

Yeah, what were those vampire things again from blood magik? I never saw one. And yes, Golden Dawn is a way to learn if you want to get sucked into an Occult. My unkle was part of them. But that's all crazy shit man. Oh, and I had it kinda explained to me as blood is energy. When you cut your energy is released by means of your blood. If anyone wants I can explain more but I gotta go get to work on the yard now. Just ask away. Tho I can't remember about the vamps too mutch. Aren't they something like a lesser terror or were they those demons or people who feed on your "energy"?

[sabrina_lycaulf]

Well, I did read a book on magical witches today it said that people were targeted a long time ago because it was thought they were wizards/witches when in fact they were poor people who were treated unfairly. People were prejuced against women back then.

Personally I believe magic exists in ways we don't understand - perhaps one day, there will be conclusive proof of the supernatural...

[Shalinda]

Magick is real, and there are different kinds of, not that i know them too good, but a guy i know once messed up with some black magick, the result was not good

[DarkHunter]

Magick is real, and there are different kinds of, not that i know them too good, but a guy i know once messed up with some black magick, the result was not good

Its probably his own fault. When you "Mess with" black magic and the results "aren't good" then its a good sign that you are a twit.

Here's a tip. Words, motions, specific rites and rituals mean absolutely NOTHING. They are just words, symbols, that have no real differentiation from any other combination of words and symbols.

So how does magic work? The symbols which are meaningless become magical because you give them meaning. They are tools one uses to call forth magic to change something. The magic originates from you if you are proficient. The tools, symbols, objects, words, only serve to focus your own will if they have that meaning for you.

So all kinds of "rites" (blood rituals for example) are only valid if they have use for the magician. They in themselves have no objective meaning until the magician gives them one.

Let them that can understand, understand.

[IIFerinusII]

What DarkHunter said is very true (and it is understandable just so you know DarkHunter).
A spell or ritual is basically a catalyst for an outcome that comes about through the person's postive thought and belief. You do not have to perform rituals or spells to get an outcome, but if it helps you believe that the outcome will come about, then good for you.

Magic, prayer, The Secret (for those of you who have read that book, which is a very good book by the way), and just about any of the like are all synonimous(sp.).

[Rainstorm]

Ritual is also an organized effort to concentrate and focus energy in a specific direction. Just to clarify.

[Abracadabra]

magic is a strange subject

ive practise some magic mostly tribel spells Shaman spells there fairly harmless mostly just doing strange things getting rid of pain visions all fun then ive tried blood magic DUMBESS THING IVE NEVER DONE, DOES NOTHING BUT HURT YOU! and there nothing good about it


but i do suggest tribel spells

[Transform me]

Magic is real. There is White Magic and Black Magic.
My mom's friend practices White Magic.

She says it's for curing purposes. I know she uses a lot of liquids, candles, smokes, and tea for it.

[chasingmidnight]

I believe in magic, but I think the type of magic I believe in is more subtle and unnoticed, but I believe that magic happens every day.

[Cristina]

:)) Many of this people say that the witches,wizzards...a re not real,but y wanna ask u something...does everyone of u,has some experience with this things and say that is not true?!!Y know i'm fascinated of this things and this is not all...i've known and y know persones who are practicing black magic,red magic...y know y am:))
...and you people say it's not true,so let me say something it's so fucki'n true like the water u drink every day,like wind's flows into youre hair...u feel that right??

[BlackRosePhantom]

Personally I believe magic exists in ways we don't understand - perhaps one day, there will be conclusive proof of the supernatural...

No, magic doesn't exist. My definition is simple - some force that defies all scientific means and can't be explained by the means of science. Also, you can't prove the supernatural because that is what makes it supernatural in the first place. In my eye's every thing has a scientific explanation and thus magic can not exist. Maybe there is some force out there that seems to make loop hole in the other forces of this world, but as some people here stated, it has rules as well. These rules would then imply, if it did exist, that it is still obeying the laws of the universe. And in turn, that would make it a part of science, just one that we don't fully understand yet. But until that day, I will only recognize the laws of science that are currently presented to me.

[Shield_Wulf]

:)) Many of this people say that the witches,wizzards...a re not real,but y wanna ask u something...does everyone of u,has some experience with this things and say that is not true?!!Y know i'm fascinated of this things and this is not all...i've known and y know persones who are practicing black magic,red magic...y know y am:))
...and you people say it's not true,so let me say something it's so fucki'n true like the water u drink every day,like wind's flows into youre hair...u feel that right??

Not trying to be mean or anything but you port hurt my head trying to read it.

No, magic doesn't exist. My definition is simple - some force that defies all scientific means and can't be explained by the means of science. Also, you can't prove the supernatural because that is what makes it supernatural in the first place. In my eye's every thing has a scientific explanation and thus magic can not exist. Maybe there is some force out there that seems to make loop hole in the other forces of this world, but as some people here stated, it has rules as well. These rules would then imply, if it did exist, that it is still obeying the laws of the universe. And in turn, that would make it a part of science, just one that we don't fully understand yet. But until that day, I will only recognize the laws of science that are currently presented to me.

That's all find and good for you, but you know there are somethings out there that are called Supernatural and Science can't prove or disprove them(sorry can't think of anything right now, if any one else can.....help). But an less you experience it for yourself it kind of herd to believe, I was there. And before you good and say I crazy and just want to believe(not saying you are going to but......), it plays a big part and my Spirituality and would like it if it didn't go there.

[BlackRosePhantom]

I have no clue what you "experienced", but it can be explained by science.

[Shield_Wulf]

I have no clue what you "experienced", but it can be explained by science.

I highly doubt it. But that's just what I believe okay.

[DarkHunter]

I have no clue what you "experienced", but it can be explained by science.

You are forgetting your history BlackRose. All scientific advances were at one time or another considered Magic.

I've already quoted my definition of magic, so I'll leave that alone. I will say though that some of the phenomena associated with magic (focusing of energy/pyschic force) have been scientifically observed. Magic is not so farfetched as its made out to be really. What most people don't understand though is that real magic often creates a change within a person and there is that special gray area between magic and science (in this case, pyschology).

Another thing: Magic cannot hoodwink other laws of nature. The Balance Factor applies. A talentless, tone deaf man will not suddenly be able to play flawless music and get a record contract. If you want that kind of thing, find Jesus. Magic is natural.

And there's no "white, black, red, etc." Its all the same. Magic is magic. No special colors to it. It all comes from the same inherent source. Intent doesn't suddenly change things. And the only retribution you'll get is from yourself.

[Goth Girl]

I can't remember what I was watching but I heard that majik can just be words we use every day. A class once tried an experiment where the class had two cans of beans. One can the kids told it they loved it and all and in a week it was still fine but the other they swore at and it became rotten. Also, people that get called names, even behind their back so they can't hear, will often become what people call them. If someone just says "I wish that rich bitch got fat" it may very well happen as long as the person wishing it said it out loud. Even if the rich person doesn't hear a thing. It's effected by our emotions and our minds. Our wills, or just, us. Maybe our actions. I never really thought about it but every day can be majik with the way we act even if around no one at all. Can't believe I'm just figuring this out now. Oh, because this is my last post for the weekend. To BRP, I'm going to print what you said in our ES vs CS thread and read and study it this weekend. Bye for the weekend all.

Alessandra

[West]

all of you people are so full of shit i can barely stand it

[DarkHunter]

all of you people are so full of shit i can barely stand it

Its a losing battle trying to convince them otherwise.

[Aeolus]

I can't remember what I was watching but I heard that majik can just be words we use every day. A class once tried an experiment where the class had two cans of beans. One can the kids told it they loved it and all and in a week it was still fine but the other they swore at and it became rotten. Also, people that get called names, even behind their back so they can't hear, will often become what people call them. If someone just says "I wish that rich bitch got fat" it may very well happen as long as the person wishing it said it out loud. Even if the rich person doesn't hear a thing. It's effected by our emotions and our minds. Our wills, or just, us. Maybe our actions. I never really thought about it but every day can be majik with the way we act even if around no one at all. Can't believe I'm just figuring this out now. Oh, because this is my last post for the weekend. To BRP, I'm going to print what you said in our ES vs CS thread and read and study it this weekend. Bye for the weekend all.

Alessandra

A little far fetched, but I know that weird stuff happens when you curse someone.

I liked that one episode of the twilight zone with the wrung-out old boxer who's son tried to tell him that there was magic that could help him win his last fight. He ends up regretting what he said to his son when time reverses and he ends up winning, despite that he had seemed to lose earlier in the show.

Sorry, random blas-from-the-past, I know, but I thought it maybe helped a little bit.

[UNODRAGONE]

Its a losing battle trying to convince them otherwise.


I second that

[Gilenea]

Well, I believe that "magic" is simply energy manipulation. Like Alessandra was saying, the way you feel about something effects the energy you put out, which can, in turn, be positive or nagative towards something. As for "tr00 magick" such as parlour tricks and the like, that's just someone creating a set of movements to make you THINK that a rabbit came out of thin air. It was hidden in the hat underneath a piece of black fabric all along.

Just my buck fiddy.

Gil

[Tempest]

I can't say for sure if "majik, magick, majic" or whatever other spelling you want to use is real or not. But I don't think so.
Like Morgana I was one of the teens who was into magic. I experienced some things that could not be explained by science. So how come I don't believe in magic anymore?
It's all in your head. The mind can play tricks on you...look at optical illusions. In reality the image is one way but your mind percieves it in another. You may think that you are manipulating the fabrics of the universe....you're not. If you honestly think that you, a speck in the universe, can manipulate energy...I'm sorry but you're fooling yourself. Even if that stuff did exist it is way out of our league, as we are not even close to being as "enlightened" enough to even be able to understand it, let alone use it to our advantage.
I believe in the magic of nature, giving birth is magic to me, growing up is magic to me. These things are miraculous and magical. I do not believe in magic in the sense that we can manipulate energy at will and use it to suit our specific desire.
I felt a need to post this because the majority of comments I've seen here are things that I would have posted 4 or 5 years ago. "Of course it's real, I know everything about it." No, you don't. All you know is what you've read in crock of shit books written by people who most likely were high when they experienced their "magical" events.
Sorry to burst everyone's bubble by being logical.

Edit - I know exactly what kind of comments I'll get from this post. If you have a desire to say anything along the lines of "yeah but....so many people have experienced the same things it's too much of a coincidence to be false!!" please refrain. I've heard it all, I, like you, have made up my mind as to where I stand on this subject. You all have made your opinions that magic is real clear, I'm simply asserting mine.

[Abracadabra]

Hmmm i belive in magic because i do sometimes try it, and im a Magicain and i can spot most illusions so it really makes things more amazing when something happens, something you cant explain!

[Aeolus]

Hmmm i belive in magic because i do sometimes try it, and im a Magicain and i can spot most illusions so it really makes things more amazing when something happens, something you cant explain!

I dont necessarilly believe it exists, but I dont try to throw anything out the window without more evidence than what is being presented.

I'm sure that some of what people do has in some traditional magic has an effect of some sort, as to whether or not it is of the supernatural I cannot say.

Also, I really like caveman-responses. They can be pretty 'full of shit' themselves. (i.e. they sound so stupid, that it doesn't matter what they add to the conversation)

[DarkHunter]

It's all in your head. The mind can play tricks on you...look at optical illusions. In reality the image is one way but your mind percieves it in another. You may think that you are manipulating the fabrics of the universe....you're not. If you honestly think that you, a speck in the universe, can manipulate energy...I'm sorry but you're fooling yourself.

I won't bother with "so many people." I will say though that there is some strange stuff in the world. And I won't break into idiotic astral ramblings or spout off otherworldly spirit nonsense. But I will say that the human mind is a powerful thing. It can cause things like the stigmata. It can cause people who believe they are possessed to somehow control their bloodflow and have words appear on their skin. Strange phenomena like ESP, telepathy, pyschokinesis. There's numerous research projects going on about it and there's no real conclusive data. But there is something there, if not the prepackaged crystal white lighter Sylivia Browne Wicca crap that everybody talks about.

[sai-fujiwara]

I wonder if this is the right question to ask. What I would be wondering is what magic is.

Many cultures and different societies have different names for "magic" and many more for "magic users". Some might call it "witchcraft", others call it "devil worshiping". More might call it "miracles" depending on the situation. There are more words to describe it like "luck", "the work of God", "willpower", "nature", "talent", etc.

Some might even call it "science" and say that there is no such thing as "magic". Well, does it really matter in the end? If you look at it closely, it still amounts to the same thing, no matter what we call it.

I suppose like ever so many of the users on ww.com, I am into what you would call "magic". Except I call it a different thing.

I call it faith, belief, and imagination. Many people might argue about how these words are entirely different from magic, but that is the beauty with words of any language. There are different translations no matter where you go.

As always,

Sai

(Ah, the sound of birds at 4 o'clock in the morning. I just love it.)

[Vammilious]

It is quite humerous to think that all believers in magic are considered "devil worshippers" when yet looking at the past the catholic church killed hundred's trying to convert them. Just a stupid note.

Also anyone now looking for magic is proably a lost cause because any real magic that ever whould have been discovered whould have been burd/hiden/forgoten/ect. Well look at the alchamist's time thay were great scientific discoveries but are now forgoten. it whould be the same way with magic.
I'm quite sure of this because i looked for a long time. And all the modern magic ive found is fake stuff used to drag in people who want to be wikken's.
Although even neo-druidism is almost a carcon copy of wikkinism? now when it used to be a religion of nature.

[Tempest]

It is quite humerous to think that all believers in magic are considered "devil worshippers" when yet looking at the past the catholic church killed hundred's trying to convert them. Just a stupid note.

Also anyone now looking for magic is proably a lost cause because any real magic that ever whould have been discovered whould have been burd/hiden/forgoten/ect. Well look at the alchamist's time thay were great scientific discoveries but are now forgoten. it whould be the same way with magic.
I'm quite sure of this because i looked for a long time. And all the modern magic ive found is fake stuff used to drag in people who want to be wikken's.
Although even neo-druidism is almost a carcon copy of wikkinism? now when it used to be a religion of nature.

Your posts melt my brain when I attempt to decypher them.

[silvr_werwulf]

magic is as real to people as they believe it to be, meaning you can only do it if you believe. Not only I but also my aunt and grandma believe and read up on it (my aunt not so much any more)

p.s. very hard to find the real deal

[DarkHunter]

It is quite humerous to think that all believers in magic are considered "devil worshippers" when yet looking at the past the catholic church killed hundred's trying to convert them. Just a stupid note.

Also anyone now looking for magic is proably a lost cause because any real magic that ever whould have been discovered whould have been burd/hiden/forgoten/ect. Well look at the alchamist's time thay were great scientific discoveries but are now forgoten. it whould be the same way with magic.
I'm quite sure of this because i looked for a long time. And all the modern magic ive found is fake stuff used to drag in people who want to be wikken's.
Although even neo-druidism is almost a carcon copy of wikkinism? now when it used to be a religion of nature.

What "great" scientific discoveries did the alchemists dream up that are not "lost?" Oh so they DID find the philosopher's stone then?

Most fourteen year old pagans and Wiccans (not wikken's, twit) have the same religion namely because they don't know any better.

Magic is out there for anybody with sense enough to find it. If you can't "find it" maybe you don't have magical qualities to begin with. I've heard it compared to musicians. If you're tone deaf, you wont' be a good musician no matter what. Its something you either have or you don't.