When is Champagne not Champagne?

[Vendetta]

When it's not FROM Champagne. Just recently Belgian Customs agents seized and destroyed a shipment of sparkling wine from the US labelled Champagne (http://www.reuters.com/article/pressRelease/idUS208562+10-Jan-2008+BW20080110). According to export and EU laws, the word Champagne can only refer to wine from the Champagne region in France. They consider products like this to be, essentially knock-offs.

Of course US sparkling wine producers are up in arms.

Do the Europeans have a right to protect the name of a product when it comes from a specific region?

[UNODRAGONE]

total bullshit. So that means Champagne from my region (Italy) isn't Champagne because it's not from Champagne France?

Main Entry: cham·pagne
Pronunciation: \sham-ˈpān\
Function: noun
Etymology: French, from Champagne, France
Date: 1664
1: a white sparkling wine made in the old province of Champagne, France; also : a similar wine made elsewhere

[Vendetta]

total bullshit. So that means Champagne from my region (Italy) isn't Champagne because it's not from Champagne France?

Main Entry: cham·pagne
Pronunciation: \sham-ˈpān\
Function: noun
Etymology: French, from Champagne, France
Date: 1664
1: a white sparkling wine made in the old province of Champagne, France; also : a similar wine made elsewhere
Except why would you call something a name which has to do with a specific region? Why not name a sparkling wine from Italy after the city it is made in? It gives it a brand identity.

I think for Europeans, this is a bit like calling all cola, Coke. They're not the same at all, even if the formulas are very similar.

[UNODRAGONE]

I would look at it as this (seeing as how the article refers to it being imported) if a drink is being shipped from outside the USA to the United States (example) and you want people to buy this product and be familiar with it, what else would you call it? Sparkling wine sounds ok...Champagne...muc h more extravagant!

[Vendetta]

I would look at it as this (seeing as how the article refers to it being imported) if a drink is being shipped from outside the USA to the United States (example) and you want people to buy this product and be familiar with it, what else would you call it? Sparkling wine sounds ok...Champagne...muc h more extravagant!
But that's because Champagne has built UP their reputation, and has a very specific method for the making of their wine, which is why they want to protect the Champagne name. Without the protection, any crappy vineyard could call their swill Champagne and fool consumers.

Not to mention the fact that the same grape can taste different in different regions, so Champagne is unique after all.

[RQ]

I would support the idea of Champagne pretaining only to bubbly from Champagne, France.

Uno, it would be much better for the cities in Italy which produce the same product to call their product after the city. Like he says, it's a brand recognition thing - and truly, if the Italian version is better (Italian everything is better, imnsho), people would seek it out and it would win in the market. Why is that a bad idea?

[UNODRAGONE]

I would support the idea of Champagne pretaining only to bubbly from Champagne, France.

Uno, it would be much better for the cities in Italy which produce the same product to call their product after the city. Like he says, it's a brand recognition thing - and truly, if the Italian version is better (Italian everything is better, imnsho), people would seek it out and it would win in the market. Why is that a bad idea?

I honestly couldn't say Italian champagne is better then Frances since I have never tasted French Champagne, and in Italy we do have different names for our vinos but if someone was to ask me what kind of wine to drink with what I would tell them (depending on the food), but if someone asked me what kind of wine to use as a toast I would say Champagne not wine because Champagne is unniversal were as wine it depends if you like white or red

[Vendetta]

I honestly couldn't say Italian champagne is better then Frances since I have never tasted French Champagne, and in Italy we do have different names for our vinos but if someone was to ask me what kind of wine to drink with what I would tell them (depending on the food), but if someone asked me what kind of wine to use as a toast I would say Champagne not wine because Champagne is unniversal were as wine it depends if you like white or red
OK, since we're talking Italian here, the best example I can think of is Chianti. You can't make Chianti in Napa Valley or Australia or anywhere else, OTHER than Chianti in Tuscany, because that's the NAME of the place the wine comes from. Champagne is exactly the same thing. If it's NOT from Champagne France, then it's just sparkling wine. No that doesn't have the same classy ring to it that Champagne does, but that's because Champagne producers in France in the late 1890s set about establishing that high-class branding to the wine, by associating it with well-known (and generally rich) aristocrats of the time.

Also, I'm not sure what you mean about Champagne being universal. Champagne IS white wine (even using different varietals,) it's just made a very specific way, using a secondary fermentation that infuses it with CO2. Also, Champagne is where the production of making sparkling wines was first made (by Dom Perignon.) Other than that, it's not much different from other sparkling wines.

[Lord Anubis]

Actually thats not totally true. I use to work or Constellation Wines US and they put put their own champagne and thir grapes were grown in upstate NY...Ever heard of J Roget Champagne?.....

[Spirit Wynd]

I donno...It's kinda weird...but who would buy something labeled "Sparkling Wine Beverage" as opposed to "Champagne"?

[unfitto]

Spirit Wynd, you underestimate those of us in the poor demographic.

I'm agreeing with champagne only being true champagne when it's from Champagne, France. I've never heard it said otherwise, and I don't see how it could be. Certainly there are rip-offs, but in essence they're still just sparkling white wine.

[MorganaFang]

I donno...It's kinda weird...but who would buy something labeled "Sparkling Wine Beverage" as opposed to "Champagne"?

I do, but only because it also usually has a price under $7

[Spirit Wynd]

Alrighty, excluding the price, say, both bottles were, for the sake of argument, twenty dollars. Which would you choose? "Champaign", or "Sparkling Wine Beverage"? I would chose Champaign, and, if the price differed, Champaign for special occasions. But that's just me.

[Vendetta]

Actually thats not totally true. I use to work or Constellation Wines US and they put put their own champagne and thir grapes were grown in upstate NY...Ever heard of J Roget Champagne?.....
And if your company were to import it into Europe, the shipment would be seized as conterfeit. See therein lies the problem: US producers are allowed to call their sparkling wines champagne because there is no law against it. Their wines are NOT champagne just because they SAY they are, they are only champagne if they are made in Champagne, France.

Let me ask you folks this question, how would YOU feel if someone sold you a stereo for $500 bucks that had the SONY label on it. But you come to find out it was actually made by some no-name electronics company in Taiwan? Wouldn't that be a bit of false advertising and fraud?

And of COURSE people would rather buy something called Champagne, just as most people would rather buy something called Coca Cola rather than just some generic cola. That doesn't mean you get to call your product Coke.

[Spirit Wynd]

Alright, I agree. But when a store calls their cola Kola-Kola or something close...or a real life example would be the drug Claritin, and it's knockoff, Wallitin, from Walgreen’s. There close, and aren't they the same thing? I don't know all that much about winemaking, but surely the grapes from Champaign are as good as the grapes from the U.S.?

[Vendetta]

I don't know all that much about winemaking, but surely the grapes from Champaign are as good as the grapes from the U.S.?
As good as? I don't know, and that's not really the point; it's not a quality issue.

Grapes grown in the Champagne region are unique to that region, even from the EXACT same variety of grape grown in say, California. The reason for that is that the same grape varietals can differ in acidity, sweetness, and a handful of other factors that affected by regional soil, climate, the water used to cultivate the grapes, etc. So you see wine made with grapes in Champagne is going to taste completely different from wine made with the exact same type of grapes grown in a different region.

Now, back to the cola debate (your examples of pharmaceuticals doesn't work for a variety of reasons.) No one but Coke can make Coke because, a) they own the copyright to that name, b) the formula is proprietary and a closely-guarded secret.

[MorganaFang]

Let me ask you folks this question, how would YOU feel if someone sold you a stereo for $500 bucks that had the SONY label on it. But you come to find out it was actually made by some no-name electronics company in Taiwan? Wouldn't that be a bit of false advertising and fraud?


Thats what happened with my car, I thought it was a honda because it was under the honda label but it was made by something completely different