Wicca and Witchcraft

[LupineShaman]

I noticed that there are a lot of threads about the catholic church and that is about it. So, I wanna talk about my religion. The path of Wicca and the study of Witchcraft.
Please, keep it civil. The last thing I want it for every bible thumper to come in here and bad mouth something they don't understand. If you have nothing nice to say then please don't respond. I wanted to find out about the way other Wiccans practice the religion.
I am an eclectic solitary practitioner with the root of my beliefs being the old Norse religion. For me spells consist very little of words and potions and candles. Mostly it done through the concentration of energy. The words and ingredients to potions are only things to help focus. I am aligned with the Hunter point of the pentacle. Because of this I can concentrate large amouts of energy rather quickly to do what needs to be done. I make praise to several Gods and Godesses, instead of the traditional God of the Hunt and Godess of the Earth.
Now tell me how you practice Wicca.

[LV426]

I noticed that there are a lot of threads about the catholic church and that is about it. So, I wanna talk about my religion. The path of Wicca and the study of Witchcraft.
Please, keep it civil. The last thing I want it for every bible thumper to come in here and bad mouth something they don't understand. If you have nothing nice to say then please don't respond. I wanted to find out about the way other Wiccans practice the religion.
I am an eclectic solitary practitioner with the root of my beliefs being the old Norse religion. For me spells consist very little of words and potions and candles. Mostly it done through the concentration of energy. The words and ingredients to potions are only things to help focus. I am aligned with the Hunter point of the pentacle. Because of this I can concentrate large amouts of energy rather quickly to do what needs to be done. I make praise to several Gods and Godesses, instead of the traditional God of the Hunt and Godess of the Earth.
Now tell me how you practice Wicca.
There will be no badmouthing bible thumpers because I have my static electricity zapper and they all fear me!

Anyway, are you referring to Wicca in specific? Or witchcraft in general? Or are you encompassing all with paganism? Because from what I can tell you are more paganistic than wiccan. Wicca is a specific religion now.

[MorganaFang]

I noticed that there are a lot of threads about the catholic church and that is about it. So, I wanna talk about my religion. The path of Wicca and the study of Witchcraft.
Please, keep it civil. The last thing I want it for every bible thumper to come in here and bad mouth something they don't understand. If you have nothing nice to say then please don't respond. I wanted to find out about the way other Wiccans practice the religion.
I am an eclectic solitary practitioner with the root of my beliefs being the old Norse religion. For me spells consist very little of words and potions and candles. Mostly it done through the concentration of energy. The words and ingredients to potions are only things to help focus. I am aligned with the Hunter point of the pentacle. Because of this I can concentrate large amouts of energy rather quickly to do what needs to be done. I make praise to several Gods and Godesses, instead of the traditional God of the Hunt and Godess of the Earth.
Now tell me how you practice Wicca.

Witch, former wiccan, and dead christian. Course nowadays you could say I've hung up my "witchiness" to search more for understanding of all things. I don't believe I have powers to physically manipulate, but I'm pretty good with herbal healing so I guess thats what I take still from me being a witch.

Somewhere I read that wicca once refered to woman who were wise, in otherwords aware of their own death and this gave them a sort of power. Yeah I'm repeating myself from other threads, but oh well.

[LupineShaman]

Wicca is a specific religion now.
Current wicca, i'm sorry to say, has changed too much. It has been comercialized by people like Silver Ravenwolf, and dumbed down by people like Gerald Gardner. Wicca is not suposed to be an organized religion. I follow the old ways. In which whatever is believed is right. I say that I make praise to many Gods and Godesses, but they are all specific personalities of the one. It makes it easier to make the point when talking to only the part of the diety that you are trying to reach. Too much is taken in the wrong way when you speak in general.
And why not, lets make this thread cover all of paganism. Old ways and New ways. Maybe I can get back some faith that the religion wasn't too horribly destroyed when people tried to organize it.

[LupineShaman]

Somewhere I read that wicca once refered to woman who were wise, in otherwords aware of their own death and this gave them a sort of power.
Wicca was the first form of belief in a higher power. But along the way it became more associated with women, and at one point the thought of a male witch was completely obserd. And I find that it isn't being aware of ones death that brings power, it is more the ability to embrace it as a part of the cirle of existance and not fear it.
Sorry if I seem to have an answer or comment for everything, but I love to share knowledge in the hopes of gaining more for myself. :)

[MorganaFang]

Wicca was the first form of belief in a higher power. But along the way it became more associated with women, and at one point the thought of a male witch was completely obserd. And I find that it isn't being aware of ones death that brings power, it is more the ability to embrace it as a part of the cirle of existance and not fear it.
Sorry if I seem to have an answer or comment for everything, but I love to share knowledge in the hopes of gaining more for myself. :)

Actually you are right, but back in the old old days wicca wasn't exactly refered to as wicca. And also about the death thing that was what I meant but enjoy giving short answers pretending everyone can read my mind.

[Frostbeard]

I am an eclectic solitary practitioner with the root of my beliefs being the old Norse religion.

Really. How exactly do you base your beliefs in forn sed?

Wicca was the first form of belief in a higher power.

Oh my...

The idea that Wicca is somehow the "first" religion is more than a little ridiculous. Certainly Wicca shares some beliefs that could be traced back to primitive humanity, but so does every other religion.

But along the way it became more associated with women, and at one point the thought of a male witch was completely obserd.

I think you're quite mistaken here. At least historical, folkloric and mythological information (not to mention the origins of the modern revival) don't support your statement. What lead you to this conclusion?

Wicca is the masculine form of the word. Wicce would be the feminine. It was always in reference to the person rather than the practice, however. It's derived from the Old Norse vitki, which means "wise one".

[LupineShaman]

Oh my...

The idea that Wicca is somehow the "first" religion is more than a little ridiculous. Certainly Wicca shares some beliefs that could be traced back to primitive humanity, but so does every other religion.
Every other religion? The first two diety ever worshiped, as far as can be told, were the God of the Hunt and the Godess of the Earth. How exactly does every other religion incorperate that? And of course it wasn't called that back then, it didn't have a name, it was just known. Just about the entire belief system can be traced back, not just some beliefs.
And about the women thing, the uninformed people caused the streotypical witch to be female. And you shouldn't be so rude when trying to make a point.

[MorganaFang]

Every other religion? The first two diety ever worshiped, as far as can be told, were the God of the Hunt and the Godess of the Earth.

Actually, no, not even for early Western European pagan, I should have read your first sentence better. Frost is right. Not to mention you are playing a bias, several other cultures had their own gods, there was never really one supreme early religion. Wicca is definitely a more recent phenomina based on other pagan religions and EVEN a little christain. Though it has been argued that wicca predates christianity. I'm really unsure. Actually if I remember right from text books (I'm sure frost will correct me later) but actually there wasn't really ever an early religion that saw only two gods. And I think you may also have some gender issues here too.

Bet you can't also believe that there were some atheists in ancient times too. Just a random thing from an atheist friend.


How exactly does every other religion incorperate that? And of course it wasn't called that back then, it didn't have a name, it was just known. Just about the entire belief system can be traced back, not just some beliefs.
Uhhh, even I know that is false, the "whole" religion has had some major changes over the years.
I also want to add that shamanism isn't a part of wicca it is actually a Native American based practice, though I have heard that some Asian cultures have had shamans.

And about the women thing, the uninformed people caused the streotypical witch to be female. And you shouldn't be so rude when trying to make a point.


Another ACTUALLY here, no no no.... The witch this isn't stereotypical, older women have always been refered to as witches. That evolves from this ideal of older women who were wise in the ways of the world because they had past all their cycles and know knew a woman's path. (and how to avoid it in some cases) Most men in this time saw this as unfavorable to their cause. So all words that kindly represented older women like "hag" turned into the negative meaning we have today. Witch is a more recently used word and yes the first time it was used was in context to woman.

[LV426]

OK I'm going to interject here because some of you are a bit off. The first religion was not based on the hunter and the goddess. You see the first type of religion was a form of Shamanism and or Animism. While most people consider shamanism to be a strictly Native American "religion" it started way before the Native Americans ever migrated to North America.

30,000 years ago give or take, humans began to live in highly organized social groups. These were mostly hunter gatherers that had developed permanent living areas and while they did wander in the spring and summer months hunting and harvesting they began to return to a central living area, either a natural cave formation which provided winter shelter or in some areas they "made" caves out of animals bones, skins, and wood in the areas. Also during the summer months the different groups in the areas would gather to exchange goods, trade stories, find marriages among other groups and even congregate for large hunting parties which enabled a chancce for larger game to be targeted so that survival was more likely during the hard months of winter.

As these groups began to draw together more and keep closer to one another, the free time began to become more abundant. With more hands to help obtain supplies for winter there was more time to devote to philosophical ponderings, artistic endeavors, and a sort of religion. Elders took the role of teaching the young respect for the earth and it's providing nature. Some became the first shamans, men and women that would seek out answers to the questions of the people and themselves. Why the season change, why animals join in spring to bring forth life, why women sometimes have children while others don't. It gave birth to a polytheistic belief system and one that is close to animism, the belief that everything, rocks, trees, animals, and the earth itself has a spirit or a force.

A very primitive concept but one that is shown in all areas through anthropological studies. This polytheism was the beginning of an organized religion but it took many thousands of years before monotheism became popular. For while some groups did acknowledge that there was an earth spirit or "goddess", they also recognized other spirits and "gods" as being just as important. There weren't exactly sacrifices made as important ceremonies to honor certain times of the year and rites that were observed in acts such as marriage and death. In fact Death became a very important aspect of this polytheism. Many burial grounds have been discovered with individuals having undergone serious rites and were adorned in elaborate clothes and jewelry of the times. Some even had "cemetaries" where their dead were placed and returned back to the earth from which they were born. Certain colors of the earth and animals were considered sacred and venerated, while others thought that certain natural and geological events were messages from the spirits.

Of course most of this is conjecture by anthropologists. These peoples did not have written words and records of their history, but there have been messages left and deciphered by those who have made it their life to interpret the leavings of the past. Caves have been the most prominant and lasting evidence of such a belief system, as have burial grounds and excavations of living areas. Unfortunately with the passage of time many of the evidence has been reduced to ashes and dust.

But from these early polytheistic beliefs has come the religions of ancient times. In the ancient world Egyptians, Babylonians, and Assyrians worshipped a plurality of deities, as did the ancient Greeks, Romans, and Norse. A system of gods, some forgiving, some loving, and some indifferent, but gods that watched the mortals below and could bestow rewards or punishment without provocation.

These ancient religions have given way before more modern religions but to give credit, most of the world's religions are indeed polytheistic. With the exceptions of the monotheisms of Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, the world's religions are overwhelmingly polytheistic. Polytheism characterizes Hinduism, Mahayana Buddhism, Confucianism, Taoism, and Shintoism in the East, contemporary African tribal religions, and even the Native American belief system of today. Some of the ancient religions have even experianced a sort of resurrection by modern groups today. And while the rites and worship is not the same as the ancient beliefs, the gods and goddesses have once agaain risen from the dust of death and entered into the human belief in a higher power.

For decades, scholars have tried to penetrate the Bible's story about Israelite monotheism. According to traditional interpretations of the Bible, monotheism was part of Israel's original covenant with Yahweh on Mount Sinai, and the idolatry subsequently criticized by the prophets was due to Israel's backsliding from its own heritage and history with Yahweh. However, scholars have long noted that beneath this presentation lies a number of questions.

Why do the Ten Commandments command that there should be no other gods "before Me" (the Lord), if there are no other gods as claimed by other biblical texts? Why should the Israelites sing at the crossing of the Red Sea that "there is no god like You, O Lord?" (Exodus 15:11). Such passages suggest that Israelites knew about other gods and did not simply reject them. It seems that Israelites may have known of other deities and perhaps various passages suggest that behind the Bible's broader picture of monotheism was a spectrum of polytheisms that centered on the worship of Yahweh as the pantheon's greatest figure.

As a result of comparing biblical and inscriptional evidence with the Ugaritic texts, we can see how the worship of other deities lasted for quite a long time in Israel down to the Exile in ca. 586.


It seemed that a true version of monotheism began to emerge in the sixth and seventh centuries. It is in this period when the clearest monotheistic statements can be seen in the Bible, for example, in the apparently seventh-century works of Deuteronomy 4:35, 39, 1 Samuel 2:2, 2 Samuel 7:22, 2 Kings 19:15, 19, and Jeremiah 16:19, 20 and the sixth-century portion of Isaiah 43:10-11, 44:6, 8, 45:5-7, 14, 18, 21, and 46:9.


At the same time that the Israelites were begining on their montheistic journey, they were surrounded by ancient polytheistic religions. Atheism and polytheism was not particularly attractive to the Israelite people in ancient times. They were convinced that only fools would be so spiritually ignorant as to deny the existence of a supreme being. For the people of God, the fear of the Lord was the beginning of wisdom and knowledge. But if the Israelites did not doubt that there was at least one God, the nations on their borders faced them with the tantalizing possibility that there might be more than one. Egypt, Phoenicia, Aram, Ammon, Moab, Edom, these and other nations were polytheistic, henotheistic, or monolatrous throughout their history in ancient times.

This monotheistic religion became known as Judaism and through that evolved Christianity. Some percieve the christian view of the holy trinity to be a kind of polytheism but many christians and catholics disagree. They consider them one and the same, but does it follow that Jesus is God? God is the Father, Jesus is the Son, and the Holy Spirit is the essence of god?

It is often said that it is Christ's resurrection that accounts for the birth and spread of Christianity across the Roman Empire but is this an accurate statement? In the early first century, visions, apparitions, and resurrections were not considered absolutely extraordinary, let alone totally unique. The ancient world was full of stories about such events, and about gods and goddesses appearing on earth in various guises and performing wonders. And although Paul laid great emphasis on the resurrection of Jesus, he didn't think of this as a unique event; on the contrary, he regarded it as a token of the forthcoming general resurrection, in which all Christians would share and be transformed.


Unfotunately no one knows the truth behind the true beginning of Christianity and the divergence of this monotheistic religion. While both believe in the same god, and revere him as the only god, there is the question of his son and God's venture to earth that separates the beliefs. Some even claim that with Jesus and the spirit of Christ and God that Christians and Catholics have diverged from a monotheistic path and in fact taken on a polytheistic view of religion.



Ah well they can believe what they want, I am still God. :cool:

[Frostbeard]

Every other religion? The first two diety ever worshiped, as far as can be told, were the God of the Hunt and the Godess of the Earth.

I'd be interested to see where you got this information from, since I've never seen anything to back it up.

How exactly does every other religion incorperate that? And of course it wasn't called that back then, it didn't have a name, it was just known.

You know very well that I wasn't saying every religion worships the same deities as Wiccans do.

However what I WAS saying is that Wicca has elements that can be traced back to early humanity. So does Christianity. So does Hinduism. So does pretty much any given religion. None of them are the "first" religion. In fact, the "first" religion doesn't exist anymore. Belief systems evolve and diversify naturally. They have to, or they lose relevance and people lose interest.

Just about the entire belief system can be traced back, not just some beliefs.

I'd love to see some evidence of that. Care to point me towards a source? Perhaps a paper, book, magazine article, or even a well-researched website? I mean, you must have some kind of source for information like this.

Seriously, where have you seen that the entirety of the Wiccan religion can be traced back to ancient times? One or two practices and beliefs, yes, certainly, but the whole bloody religion? That's hard to believe.

And about the women thing, the uninformed people caused the streotypical witch to be female.

Yeah, my point exactly. I think, however, that the ignorant people you're thinking of are a very different group than the ignorant people I'm thinking of.

And you shouldn't be so rude when trying to make a point.

You have no idea how much restraint I have shown.

[Stygian]

I have found many different books on wicca and witchcraft, so many different ideas and practices that I have started just taking what works and is useful to me. I have read that the best magick comes from within each individual and the practices should be made on a personal level so I change them all to fit in a more accurate manner.
My question is this... is this common practice? Also, why call yourselves wiccan in the first place? In the eyes of the christian religion you are and always will be a witch... so embrace what you are proudly and freely.

One more thing, do any of you have an older copy of the key of solomon not written by Crowley?
I would be very interested in buying or trading for this from you.

[Stygian]

that I can kill this topic too and no one at all will talk to me here.

Ahh how I forgot what it was like to be shunned by a society, to be ignored by those with a holier than thou attitude.

[ThrasherCub]

LupineShaman, you and I have very (VERY) simmilar systems going on. Only difference is that I mix in a lot of symbols. LOTS of symbols.

[Cephas]

I am sure that (by now) nearly everybody on these boards considers me a bible-basher.
In fact, I consider a lot of Wicca to be true. Christianity is a guide to "love thy neighbour" type-things, so if you don't think you are of that mentality, try something else, and enjoy it.
I think the only thing I would not agree with is the polytheism, but all the stuff with energies and spirits isn't contradicted, so for all I know it could be true.

[WhiteCrowUK]

I am sure that (by now) nearly everybody on these boards considers me a bible-basher.
In fact, I consider a lot of Wicca to be true. Christianity is a guide to "love thy neighbour" type-things, so if you don't think you are of that mentality, try something else, and enjoy it.
I think the only thing I would not agree with is the polytheism, but all the stuff with energies and spirits isn't contradicted, so for all I know it could be true.

I agree Cephas - although I am kind of Pagan, I do find I dont have to dump all Christianity to be one.

Certainly I doubt the institutions of Paganism and the Church will never get on too well though!

For me I have no problem with the polytheism - I guess its all the way you look at it. The Christian faith itself has a kind of polytheism in its "God in three persons; father, son and holy spirit".

I know many people have trouble with that. And I'm told the holy spirit used to be thought of as a femine force of creation, before the religion got all politican!

[MorganaFang]

For me I have no problem with the polytheism - I guess its all the way you look at it. The Christian faith itself has a kind of polytheism in its "God in three persons; father, son and holy spirit".

Divinety, is all one thing, its just three parts of it. One God, three phases of being.

[WhiteCrowUK]

Divinety, is all one thing, its just three parts of it. One God, three phases of being.

Ooh getting smart with me are you? :D

Actually I was going to get more into detail, but I thought it would be too geeky, but now the gloves are off ...

When I trained to be a good little Christian boy, I had to take a series of special lessons with a Vicar about faith. Perhaps its a VERY BRITISH thing. In the same way as James Bond needs a "license to kill", budding Christians in the Church of England get confirmed which is a kind of "license to be a practising Christian". Its perhaps little wonder then that so many members of the Church of England are accountants and bank managers.

Anyway back on track ...

We were told that the word "person" used in "God in three persons" comes from a Greek word which means "mask". The idea was that there is one God, and these entities are masks he puts on so we can understand him.

Its definitely something which stayed with me anyway. We are all a bit given to take on different roles and putting on a different face when we do it. For instance, I am "father, son and unholy pain in the ass" depending on who you speak to about me! :)

[Cephas]

Oh yeah, and another thing: Idols. God really "hates" these. So no effigies either. Or altars. I'll probably think of some more in a minute...

[Wiccablood]

I can do it... It is soo... Cool! I sent hundreds of ghosts back to the afterlife!

[Fascination]

Oh yeah, and another thing: Idols. God really "hates" these. So no effigies either. Or altars. I'll probably think of some more in a minute...

I dont believe in Christianity myself (while still of course respecting its teachings and those who are of that faith) but I know about how God really hates those who believe in idols and my question is this; why wear a cross around your neck?
Many people I see these days who say they are Christian dont actually know much about Christianity itself and only wear the cross because they see other people doing so. To me this seems more like a belief in the cross rather than God himself.

P.S. How many of you have seen Bill Hicks' view on the cross?
"Do you think when Jesus comes back hes going to want to see another fucking cross?"

[Fascination]

I can do it... It is soo... Cool! I sent hundreds of ghosts back to the afterlife!

Then you rolled a 1 on a d10 roll and botched? You poor thing.

[Cephas]

The difference being that Christians do not worship the cross, we simply use them as a reminder of His sacrifice for all of us.
And we don't have to wear one - I don't.
PS. Lol, I like that idea, but it won't matter to Jesus, for when He comes again He'll be immortal, not in human form (I think, anyway. Read Revelations, very informative Bible chapter)

[Fascination]

And we don't have to wear one - I don't.

Sorry, I didnt mean to imply that you had to wear one, I just ment that alot of people I encounter these days seem to hold more faith in the pendant rather than in God. :)

[Cephas]

I think if you actually went and asked them, most would just be wearing it as jewellery. But those who wore it for a religious reason would not be worshipping or having faith in the pendant itself. Please read posts carefully.

[Wiccablood]

I tried binding my ex-friend... I think I messed up a little bit....

[MorganaFang]

I can do it... It is soo... Cool! I sent hundreds of ghosts back to the afterlife!
Riiiiiiight, you know, wicca isn't about the dead. I have run across very few thing dealing with such.

[Wiccablood]

Yes... There is a girl ghost in my house and she loves me...

[MorganaFang]

Yes... There is a girl ghost in my house and she loves me...
Not what this thread is about, but if you must get on about dead people loving one another. If she loves you and shes dead, what are you going to do about it?

[Wiccablood]

Magic! That was my main purpose of trying it out! I want to create a new body for her...

[MorganaFang]

Magic! That was my main purpose of trying it out! I want to create a new body for her...
Voodoo practice, and other pagan ones. Hardly wiccan. Actually very against wicca.

[Wiccablood]

I admit I do both good and bad magic... I am trying to keep my mind clear....

[MorganaFang]

I admit I do both good and bad magic... I am trying to keep my mind clear....
In the wiccan faith, there is no power in evil magic(Magick, Magik), hence in that mind set evil bad magic doesn't exist. Maybe you should research instead of watching movies and reading articles off the internet. Even really good Wiccan websites say that they do possess information that is faulty when compared to books and other sources.

[WhiteCrowUK]

The difference being that Christians do not worship the cross, we simply use them as a reminder of His sacrifice for all of us.


I think you'll find the same applies to Pagans. We dont worship a statue or a tree, but they represent something bigger. They give God(dess) a presence in any worship.

[WhiteCrowUK]

P.S. How many of you have seen Bill Hicks' view on the cross?
"Do you think when Jesus comes back hes going to want to see another fucking cross?"

By the same token, I dont think he'll be too keen on an extended DVD copy of Mel Gibsons "The Passion".

Actually I wonder if when that does come out to buy they will be able to resist the tag line "Jesus Christ comes again on DVD". :confused:

[Fascination]

You may wish to consider you own advice carefully; read the posts you refer to properly. The point I was making is that these people I refer to do believe in God, but dont actually know anything about him - its like saying youre best friends with Robert Smith but youve never heard of the Cure. Surely those who actually believe in God shouldnt need to wear a reminder around their neck anyway? It would be like those of the wicca nature wearing stakes around their necks, in remeberance of the witches that were persecuted and burnt to the stake by the Church.

[WhiteCrowUK]

On a Wicca related subject - I have just been looking at Wicca shops in my general area. This is annoying because I need a new athame, and dont really like buying on line (I like to caress before I buy you see).

How annoying is this? I found out there is a shop down the road from somewhere I used to work at (which is less than convenient), a military site disguised hidden from locals behind a golf course (apparently terrorists know where to find it though) ...

[Frostbeard]

So while we're on the topic of pendants, I know it's not required to wear one, as Cephas mentioned. But if you choose to wear one and you know what you're wearing (cross for Xtianity, pentagram for paganism, etc), would a Wiccan wear anything? Or is Wicca more of a belief than wearing something that designates you as Wiccan?

Wicca is a belief system, a.k.a. a religion. Many Wiccans choose to wear pentagram pendants.

Christianity is a belief system, a.k.a. a religion. Many Christians choose to wear crucifix pendants.

Wearing a pentagram pendant does not make one a Wiccan anymore than wearing a crucifix makes one a Christian.

[Cephas]

Many Christians choose to wear crucifix pendants.

Wearing a pentagram pendant does not make one a Wiccan anymore than wearing a crucifix makes one a Christian.
True, although there is a difference: a crucifix is a cross with an image of Jesus on it. Some Christians prefer plain crosses, as no-one really knows what Jesus looked like (see this topic (http://www.werewolf.com/vb/showthread.php?t=416 9)).

[doopie]

i life in holland, and a lot of my friends are wicca. i don't really understand it BUD i respect it. and it's cool to see riteul stuff.

(Don't mind the bad spelling)